| AROUND THE RINGS - AROUND THE RINGS POLL: CUTTING SPORTS FROM THE OLYMPICS -> Welcome to the latest poll ! | Start A New Topic | Reply |
| Post Info | TOPIC: Welcome to the latest poll ! |
| Posted By: Ed Hula, ATR Editor Posted On: Sep 4, 2002 Views: 560 | Welcome to the latest poll ! Thanks for all the interest in the first ATR Poll last month on the U.S. candidate for the 2012 Olympics. We look forward to your vote on which sports might be cut from the Summer Olympic program. We'll be following up in a subsesquent poll that will cover sports that could be added to the Olympic program. |
| Posted By: myles garcia Posted On: Sep 4, 2002 Views: 557 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Hey, Ed. This is a great website. I called you last week at your Atlanta # to add some comments on the NYC-SF final stage of the US 2012 race; but didn't get a call back. I'd still like to make some comments at some appropriate site, but are you just reserving that for subscribers? Thanks. |
| Posted By: myles garcia Posted On: Sep 4, 2002 Views: 556 | Sports to be cut from the Olympics 1. Boxing. This is a stupid, belligerent "sport." What "satisfaction" does one get from hitting another? And if the judging situation in figure skating is scandalous, look into boxing's. 2. Weightlifting. ANother "sport" which doesn't make sense to me, but just a great cause for getting hernias and taking more steroids. And as for adding women to this sport, oy! Turn back the clock to no-TV days!!! 3. Field Hockey. How different is this from La Crosse or criquet? I mean, hitting it with a stick? 4. Far too many sports where you just try to get the ball in the big net: water polo? Handball? Field hockey? Soccer? I mean, c'mon on, foot, hand, stick, it's all the same. Just go for one! 5. Yachting. Who gets to see this in the water? It's a sailor's sport; not a viewer's sport. 6. Table Tennis. They fault Americans for calling football 'soccer.' What about Table Tennis? It's "PING-PONG, plain and simple. A garage game. After Beijing 2008, they should just junk this, or move it to the Winter Games. IMHO. |
| Posted By: Ed Hula, ATR Editor Posted On: Sep 4, 2002 Views: 551 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Hi myles, thanks for writing. This is our only forum for now. Please feel free.... |
| Posted By: Johnson King Posted On: Sep 9, 2002 Views: 521 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Myles. Settle down comrade and put a little more thought into your arguments. It seems you have very little experience with any of the sports you criticize. Certainly boxing, in its current form, has strong elements of brutality. As a sport, I would not choose to participate in it. The issues surrounding boxing as a sport have been debated for decades. However, the skills learned from the art of boxing, especially in a defensive sense, are valuable. Fighting, unfortunately is a fact of life. There will always be evil and aggressors, and the sports of archery, shooting, fencing, judo, taekwondo, karate and all of the other martial arts, and boxing all have their value in defending one from aggressors as well as having become sports. Due to the perennial judging scandals in boxing it would be on my list to eliminate. Im fairly certain from your remarks that you have never participated in any weightlifting competition. Weightlifting is a tremendous sport, a skill and one of the most basic physical tests of all. It has worldwide appeal. People all over simply want to know who is the strongest. The lifts involved take tremendous athleticism. The drug issue unfortunately does tarnish this sport. Your comment on women smacks of jealousy because they lift more than you do. Field Hockey, Lacrosse, Cricket? The same? Water Polo, Football (soccer) Handball, Field Hockey, all the same? Wow, Id suggest a good sports encyclopedia for starters. These are all so different there is no place to start. If these sports are all the same, try taking the competitors and interchange them. Let the Soccer players play Water Polo and vice versa. (But be sure to take along several extra lifeguards) Please educate yourself with that encyclopedia on the finer points of each sport before posting anything else that insipid. Yachting is not a spectator sport, agreed. The cost and inaccessibility of this sport make the pool of possible participants very small relative to other sports. Venues many times need to be far away from the other Olympic venues. With no disrespect to Mr. Rogge, its a good candidate to eliminate. Table Tennis at the world level tests skills that are far and above any ping-pong that you or I have played. Youve clearly not watched a world class match, or you would know that one would need a 10-car garage to play a real game. It may not be your sport of choice, or mine, and it may not be the greatest test of strength or stamina, but it tests quickness, agility, concentration, hand-eye coordination, and the ability to read ones opponent and react to skills, weaknesses and strategies. At some point opinion comes into play, and as groups, organizations, and societies, we come to some collective agreement as to what sports to include in the games. These decisions must be soundly based on fact, and not, not-so-humble, poorly thought out tirades. Johnson King |
| Posted By: Myles Posted On: Sep 9, 2002 Views: 518 | RE: Back to Johnson King Well, Johnson, we were asked what "sports" we would like to see eliminated. You're entitled to your opinion; and I am entitled to mine. As for being "jealous about women weightlifters," uh-huh. Yeah, I envy all those sinewy bodies where they all look like Mr. Universe bodies w/ the heads just digitally changed. But, if that's what floats your boat, then fine by me. It's just not mine. I still think it's a stupid "sport" regardless. Besides, I have more important things to do than study peripheral Olympic "sports" in depth as you do. It's my time, not yours. |
| Posted By: Johnson King Posted On: Sep 10, 2002 Views: 509 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Myles, Your hasty 17 minute 20 second reply, belies the notion that you have more important things to do than study peripheral Olympic sports. However, your self admission that you do not study these issues, is consistent with your void of factually basis opinions. This is further proven by your confusion between the sports of weightlifting, an Olympic sport, and bodybuilding, not an Olympic sport. Once again, an elementary sports encyclopedia will most certainly provide you with enlightenment on this matter. The Mr. Universe physiques you speak of are consistent with the sport of bodybuilding. Weightlifters can come in various states of musculature, some not that flattering at all. Perhaps you remember the name Alexeyev, or probably not. For incontrovertible proof, see the photos of women weightlifting at the 2000 Olympic Games on this page http://www.canoe.ca/2000GamesGallery/weightlifting.html compared to the female bodybuilders on this page. http://www.femalemuscle.com/ Big difference. Since you have admitted you dont study these issues, best to leave the discussion to those that do. Johnson King |
| Posted By: Myles Posted On: Sep 10, 2002 Views: 506 | Up yours, Johnson! You know, Johnson, this is an OPEN forum, so people are free to chime in with our opinions!! I don't care what so-called authority or knowledge you supposedly have regarding the subject. Are you the only one with an opinion? The site ISN'T yours, and neither is the Olympics. Up yours, Johnson! |
| Posted By: Johnson King Posted On: Sep 10, 2002 Views: 500 | RE: Sports to be cut from the Olympics Lets not lose our temper here Myles, show some maturity. I never said you didnt have the right to post your opinions, post away! What I did say, was that the quality of your remarks is sorely lacking in thought. Remember, you are the one that stated that you do not study these issues. It shows. Yes. I value an educated opinion over an uneducated one, and most educated people would agree. You write, Its my time, not yours. Think about it. What you write has the potential, in certain contexts, to be read by great numbers of people. That is their time, not yours. Dont you owe it to them to bring a more well thought out argument to the discussion than your original post? In an objective manner, I granted you three points from your original post. Boxing has judging problems; weightlifting has steroid issues; sailing is not a spectator sport. These are opinions based on fact, and could be used to argue that these sports be removed from the Olympic Games. The balance of your argument was emotional and revealed a distinct lack of knowledge on the sports discussed. Why don't you back your argument up with a list or series of points that shows how water polo, handball, field hockey and soccer are the same. I'll come up with a list of how they differ. Consider me an adversary, if you must, a worthy opponent in a lively debate that will help you to hone your thinking and your own arguments and make them more valuable and convincing. Your turn, Johnson King |
| Posted By: myles garcia Posted On: Sep 10, 2002 Views: 497 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Yeah, Johnson, I did lose my cool there because of your condescending, OVER-BEARING, PATRONIZING tone -- like you are the only one with THE VALID OPINION!! That's why. I never professed to have deep knowledge of these sports or their merits. And I don't have to justify why some sports appeal to me and why others don't. Why do you like blue over pink; or a BMW over a Chevy? Why do I like Paris over Rome? It's all a matter of taste. That was the ORIGINAL proposition. I'll say this about handball, soccer, field hockey, water polo, ice hockey...they're all pretty much the same principle: get the neutral item, the ball, into the opponent's net at the other end of the field, be it by foot, by hand, with a stick, in the pool, or on a frozen pool. If the IOC nabobs want TV ratings, give the viewers QUIDDITCH. (In case you don't know, that's the game from "Harry Potter") I'll take that anytime over those other boring games. (BUt I like the World Cup.) I really do NOT care to go any deeper into the merits of the other sports. Besides, you're missing the whole point of this thread: it's one's INDIVIDUAL ideas (not that the IOC will ADOPT them) on cutting down the Summer Olympic slate because it has gotten SO BIg and expensive. You did read why baseball & softball are the primary candidates? Therefore, I really also do NOT understand why there should still be a football/soccer tournament in the Olympics when there is the World Cup already, and the Olympic soccer tournament requires 4 venues that are usually far-flung from the main host city. THat is the WHOLE POINT of this thread and exercise; not me vs. you; which you turned it into, and which I take great offense at...in case you haven't already noticed. And yes, I do have a short temper. |
| Posted By: Johnson King Posted On: Sep 12, 2002 Views: 489 | RE: Sports to be cut from the Olympics Myles, (or do you prefer the metric Kylometers) It was only condescending in that there was no place for your arguments to go but up. Your original post came across as mere pedestrian blather, was written in a pompous tone and then contradictorily signed, IMHO. The lack of accuracy in the post merited a strong response. Had you done your research you would have an understanding of why soccer is still included in the Olympic Games. Perhaps you didnt know that the Olympic soccer tournament (for men at least) is, with a few specific exceptions, basically for players 23 and under. You might argue, big deal different age groups. Whats so different about that. Obviously the decision makers thought it was different enough to establish the rule. Are you proposing that any other sport with a major world tournament or championship not be included in the Olympic Games? You seem to want to be able to make uninspired remarks, as long as there is no debate. The issue was that you shared your opinion, and that your opinion was clearly based on a lack of knowledge of what you were talking about. I simply pointed that out. Opinions and thoughts of that quality have as much chance as succeeding in this world, as your mythical quidditch has of succeeding in the Olympic world. Its intellectually lazy to think that ones individual ideas, opinions and tastes are the entire point of this discussion. No one individual makes the decisions on which sports to include or not to include in the games. However, you understood the question to say that it was your opinion or taste that mattered. I read the question to say that one should make a rational decision, and be able to back up that decision with solid facts. One would hope the IOC would also choose the latter course. In the future, realize before you post to a public forum that there is the possibility that your ideas will be confronted and challenged, and be prepared to deal with that, or pre-empt that situation by bringing solid, well-thought out arguments to the discussion in the first place. This should be done all within the context of polite discourse. Thats not always the case, as youve shown. As far as me vs. you Seems you and I are the only ones to have found this new forum so far. If I hadnt responded you would just be in here playing with yourself. If anyone else posts remarks that I feel merit a response, I will certainly do that. Johnson King |
| Posted By: myles Posted On: Sep 12, 2002 Views: 486 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Blah...blah... yeah, talk is cheap, Johnson. I don't NEED your approval or disapproval on my comments. You can stick 'em where the sun don't shine, jackass! |
| Posted By: Johnson King Posted On: Sep 13, 2002 Views: 479 | RE: Welcome to the latest poll ! Where the sun dont shine? You said you are from SFO. Therefore, the comments already came from where the sun dont shine. By the way, in your other post Why I think NYC will get it, even tho I live in SF you make some good points. Keep up the good work. Johnson |