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Post InfoTOPIC: The Folly of the Liberals
Posted By: A Citizen of the UK

Posted On: Jan 4, 2005
Views: 350
The Folly of the Liberals

Why should a government pay for the upkeep of a man's life when that man has no regard for the life of the innocent victim that he killed? It is better that the state spend the money on something else.

The death penalty allows us to get rid of those few who have commited an unforgivable act. The death itself is humane, often unlike the murder the criminal commited (i'm tinking of beatings, knife attacks, the victim being shot and bleeding to death).

Those who appose the death penalty for religious reasons should consider the idea that God would be given the oppotunity to enact his own justice sooner rather than later. Who's to say God exists anyway?


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Jan 5, 2005
Views: 347
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

I think your a mean jerk I'm only 13 (I've been 13 for 3 weeks now) and even I know no matter the circumstances it's wrong to take a persons life I maybe undecided but I find what you say quite cruel. I don't base my decision on religous belief I base them on my personal opinion so Im not saying your wrong it's your opinion, but it sounds so cruel to me. I think that they don't deserve to die that's not punishment. Punishment is there to teach not to do it again, so you learn from bad things you do it doesn't teach them anything if there dead. Let them live and atone. They don't deserve the easy way out. Even though I said I'm undecided is because it's unfair to think onsidedly on these kind of issues. :P


Posted By: The UK citizen

Posted On: Jan 13, 2005
Views: 345
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

You believe me to be cruel because you are domniated by emotion. Being 13 years old you have yet to detatch yourself from your feelings when evaluating sometimes disturbing or controversial ideas.

I do not suggest the torture of murderers. That would be cruel. I believe, however, that money spent on a known murderer could be better spent elsewhere.

Don't you think that the Nazi War criminals should have been executed?


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Jan 15, 2005
Views: 342
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

hey! did you even read more than the first line?
This has nothing to do with my age. If one of your family members died wouldn't you be ruled by emotions? You really are a jerk! If I was ruled by emotions than I would have been for it. I just like anyone wants them to be punished so that they never do it again,but to kill them doesn't seem fair. Dying is the easy way out. Not only will they not kill anymore,but they won't have to deal with the hardships of living.
No, nazi war criminals don't deserve to die. They don't deserve the easy way out. They should live with the shame for the rest of their life. Eventually they will feel the weight of their deeds. You say I'm ruled by emotionns than what are you ruled by ? Or do just justify your words because you are older than me? I hope you read the whole thing this time. :P


Posted By: Your nemesis kitsu

Posted On: Jan 16, 2005
Views: 340
RE: The Folly of the Liberals (and you)

Many victims of Nazi injustice would have felt angry and sickened if the Nazi leaders had been allowed to live after 50 million died because of the Fuhrer's deludedness. The criminals felt no shame at the Nuremburg trials, why would they feel shame at any other time? Where was their shame when they signed the death warrant of the Jewish population???

I do feel emotion young fool, especially when a family member dies, but i am not ruled by it- I won't go out and destroy a mosque, or Chinese Food Store, in a fit of insanity and rage.

":P" = your immaturity.


Posted By: hyuga

Posted On: Jan 18, 2005
Views: 333
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

I understand where you both are coming from, but you haven't aswered one of kitsu's questions. What motivates or what rules you. I think that it was a disgusting thing that they did all those things, but killing them isn't going to bring all those peoplehguyyugt. It's just the continuation of the cycle of violence. And who's to say they have no shame.


Posted By: UK citizen

Posted On: Jan 18, 2005
Views: 331
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

The violence was not instigated by the penal code. Rather in specific cases the violence was started when the murder took place.

Violence will not be got rid of if the death penalty is abolished. In fact it would certainly increase- there is a lack of an effective deterant in place. This is what has happened here under the "softly, softly" approach to crime that the Labour government supports- violent crime has increased.

What motivates me? An increase in knowlegde, and allowing for rationality to rule over emotion. However, I do take emotion into account when dealing with people less able to act maturely. This i come across alot, being 17 years old.


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Jan 19, 2005
Views: 326
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

so you think just because you're 4 years older doesn't mean that you're any more mature than I am. so what. How can you be mature if you don't even treat all people you meet with equal respect. I'm sorry if ":p" ofended you so I'll try not to do it anymore, but do you think your better than anyone else just because your older or because you've never killed anyone? Do you think your higher than some people just because you haven't done certain things? Are you any better than they are? No one is higher than anyone else. We are all equal. Who gives anyone the right to take anyones life?
people are people. A life is a life. No one deserves to take the life of another. I may sound redundant and I may sound and act immature, but I may or may not grow out of it. Despite all that Nothing will change the way I think about these kinds of issues. No matter what the crime no one has the right to take the life of another.
I'm sorry, but I'm a very stubborn person, but that doesn't mean that anyone I want everyone think the way I do. It's better to be more diverse on subjects like these.


Posted By: vash the stampede

Posted On: Jan 19, 2005
Views: 324
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

We're searching for a place
a place where we can live peaceful days
a place with no wars nor stealing
a place that isn't run by fear
a place where people can live as people
and trust other human beings
even though this place is still out of reach I'm sure that one day we'll reach it and be able to grasp it in our hands. I believe this to be so...
Wandering towards
the dream of a never-ending future.
Underneath the blue sky, the wind blows toward the future,
as if embracing the rays of the sun.


Posted By: UK citizen

Posted On: Jan 19, 2005
Views: 322
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

We are all equal. I have a BIG secret for you kitsu.....
WE ARE NOT!!!!

take this example. You, kitsu, have had a potentially fatal accident and need an immediate operation. Two people offer to perform it: one is a qualified doctor, the other is a cab driver. Who are you going to allow to do the op? Your deluded land of equalness means that you would seriously consider letting the lesser of the two perform the op. Then you would die.

Kitsu is living in a dream world where everyone is the same. Actually, people are different. Some are special at something, others are naturally talented at a completely different activity. And some humans are insignificant. Some people need killing so that the lives of the innocent are not in danger. Individual Human life can become irrelevant when the bigger picture is taken into account.

I'm very sorry if that upsets you "Kitsu". And for teenage growth 4 years is a very long time.

Nice poem Vash


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Jan 20, 2005
Views: 319
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

I believe you vash, and I believe that day that day can come sooner if people try to cooperate with eacher. UK, what gives you the right to call some people "insignificant"? Are you any better than them? I never said everyone was exactly the same. I meant that everyone deserves to be treated the same reguardless of gender, nationlity, or social status. Clearly the cab driver wouldn't be able to perform an operation, but it is unlikely that a cab driver would offer to do the operation.Also there is a chance that I could still die in the hands of a qualified doctor though it's not likely but it is possible. And it seems to me that you have very little faith in other people. I wonder why is that?I've may be known for being too trusting and I have been hurt because of that, but despite that I'm willing to give people a chance, I believe that people can change. As human beings aren't we oblidged to help our kind so that everyone can benefit. It sounds cruel just to condem. Shouldn't our job be to try to prevent senseless deaths if they can be avoided?
I guess that 4 years really is probably a big difference. If you had asked me 4 years ago about capital punishment I probably be for it, but thanks to 2 people I've learned that life is very precious. so, in their memory I can't accept the fact that taking the life of another is considered justice. sorry, I told you I was stubborn.


Posted By: UK citizen

Posted On: Jan 20, 2005
Views: 317
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

Of course it we should try to prevent senseless deaths- thats why I support the death penalty! A senseless death occured when the murder killed his innocent victim with a waraxe. The execution of the murderer would not be senseless, because the murderer will never be able to do it again afterwards.

Hopefully you will come to realise that many humans cannot change the way they are. Human imperfection is a sad fact of life. Many do not strive to perfect themselves in any meaningful way. And hopefully you will be able to ascertain who to trust and who not to. A few can change for positive reasons and they are better people for that afterwards.

Some people are indeed lower forms of life- those who choose to be pathetic tramps, and criminals. People who thrive on emotion and violence alone are inferior. These factors are not caused by gender, race, social status, nationallity or natural physical appearance: you are correct about that.


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Jan 21, 2005
Views: 314
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

I know that some people can't change and that humans are imperfect, but isn't that more of reason why we should give them chances... Is there a reason why people kill... Is it inheritance, money,revenge,or just the strong inclination to kill? Would people kill for such petty reasons? I'm sorry if I've been bothering you for the past few days or weeks... I'm sorry I'm so redundant, but I still don't think that anyone has the right to take the life of another.


Posted By: UK citizen

Posted On: Jan 23, 2005
Views: 310
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

What is the reason for killing? Ask the murderer. Unless the criminal is insane, the murderer knows exactly what they are doing. They do not deserve a second chance.

I have been bothered by you, except in your unmoveable stance in a foolish liberal position.

If you are unfortunate enough to have a relative or close friend suffer the doom of being muderered, perhaps your position would change. Not due to reasons of revenge, but because of justice.


Posted By: kitsu watanabe

Posted On: Apr 13, 2005
Views: 295
RE: The Folly of the Liberals

Actually just recently someone I know was murdered, and no I don't want to kill the murderer. Because I also know the murderer. I was angry and sad at first but I know that she wouldn't have wanted him to die even though he killed her, she was a very kind person to the end. She found out that he was on drugs and died because of her kindness. The last thing they said she said was to help him, that was right before she died right after he had attacked her. And in memory of her everyone forgave him. It's true that some murderers know exactly what they're doing, but not all of them. There are some with circumstances that drove them to kill, even though it may sound like stupid excuses. Any how does "executing" murderers make any difference, it doesn't bring back the people that were killed nor does it guarantee that it really did prevent the loss of future lives. No one can guarantee that, People do eventually change over time for better or for worse. THey may change they may not no one can be sure...