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Posted By: Catherine

Posted On: Jul 11, 2005
Views: 1598
to Devil and Integra_Fan

1)to Devil

"If something as trivial as a person you have never met saying things that you don't agree with about a fictional comic is really that important to you....you need to take a reality check.
Catherine..."

Open your eyes Devil and reread my post, please. I do not make Erin, or this comic my whole world as you imply. My world would be my family and my education. My hobby would be the SCA. My passtime when I /have/ time would be reading Shine and trying to insert rationality into this argument. Please don't insult me. You tell us we are insulting and yelling at you. Please don't do the same to us. And I notice you've posted far more on this topic than I have. Who needs the reality check???

2)To Integra_Fan

"assuming that we are childish little freaks who already worship another we do not know like the Christians worship Jesus Christ."

I truly hope you were not trying to insult a religious faith with this 'comparison'. If you were not, and I am reading this wrong, please clarify. If you mean it as an insult, I'm saddend to see such things on this board.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 11, 2005
Views: 1566
Replies

To JaneGray: Thanks. I understand why you wanted to make it clear...

To Erin: *blinks*

Order? I didn't really order her to stop. I just...asked her as nicely as I could to...let this thing rest. I'm sure that if anyone continues this defending of our beliefs, Devil May Care will most probably continue to attack us and I will defend myself. I do not take insults face down.


Posted By: Erin the Integra Fangirl

Posted On: Jul 8, 2005
Views: 1513
Posting from admissions office @ Wheaton College

Integra_fan, you can bow out of the argument yourself, but you can't order other people to stop ^_~

For those who would throw around highfalutin' legalese: It's out of place. There is no contract here; I have promised no service in exchange for money. Likewise, nobody has promised to give me any money.

I can hardly apply for a business license when I'm not selling anything ^_^

When I was ten, I got $1 a week from my parents in allowance. Should I have applied to receive a small business license to get that? Nope. It was a gift, freely given.

Gotta go. Info session. =)


Posted By: JaneGray

Posted On: Jul 8, 2005
Views: 1510
To Integra_fan

Ok, I just wanted to make myself clear, but now I will stop.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 8, 2005
Views: 1507
To JaneGray

Although I like how you presented your argument and nicely portayed the reason as to why we are still on this forum, please, I wish this to stop. My anger at Devil May Care still flares, but it seems that he/she is going to keep his insult cannons firing at us for all he/she can. And his/her ammunition is unlimited. It actually seems pointless to me. He/she's going to keep insulting us and we will keep defending both ourselves and Erin. I really do not like it that Devil May Care keeps assuming that we are childish little freaks who already worship another we do not know like the Christians worship Jesus Christ.


Posted By: JaneGray

Posted On: Jul 8, 2005
Views: 1436
To Devil May Care

"Yes, someone else called you a hypocrite"

That is not an insult, that is a fact.

1)He kept on insulting Erin and this comic ("the comic is pathetic", "don't try to teach a pig to sing") and saying he wanted to leave, then he took offense at our protests and stuck here.

2)He called us hypocrites despite the total lack of hypocrisy on our part: we never said something and then did the opposite, we stated from the very beginning that we liked Erin's comic and though that she deserved the donation, and we kept on holding that. Erin in particular never lied about her true intentions ("I am greedy", "I don't really need the money yet").

3)He doesn't know anything about any of us, yet he assumed we have no life and are easily manipulated just because we like a comic and defend our opinions.

4)Erin has been always and totally cool, polite and honest, yet he claimed she has been whining.

5)He kept on claiming making a doujinshi is wrong and Hirano would be ****ed at Erin, ignoring that Hirano himself used to be a doujinshika and sell his doujinshi for profit; he also claimed that the laws in America are different than the laws in Japan: true, but Hirano is Japanese, so it's safe to think that something that is legal in his county, and that he himself used to do, would not bother him.

6)He said "from what I have seen, you all attack anyone who does not agree with your blind worship of Erin", ignoring the fact that:
A)we were just defending our opinions, and would have done so even if we had hated Erin and Shine, and
B)he didn't just "not agree" with us, he straightly attacked us: after he said in his very first post that this comic is pathetic, did he really expect us to welcome him warmly? Even after he kept on claiming that we are a bunch of easily manipulated kids who have no life? Then he is not just an hypocrite, he is stupid.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1438
Let's stop this now

I wish to stop this argument now. I do not wish to continue it, but before that, I want to say a few things:

Devil May Care, I do not like what you are saying. You have been insulting me to such a point that I may consider flaming you for all I am worth. I know that you are trying to make your point clear without any misunderstandings, but insulting another is out of the question. I never insulted you but you kept throwing it in my face. Yes, someone else called you a hypocrite, but I did not. And if I did, which I doubt, then I apologise. If you ever want to throw any labels back, please throw it back to the original person. So you think that I'm an idiot who can't live without a single thing that is useless to others. If you do think of it that way, then please, know more about me before you say it. Misconceptions about how another person is is and have never been appreciated. I particularly dislike being thought of as one who worships someone whom he/she doesn't know at all.

A pleasant day to everyone.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1425
Mephisto

Honestly, what do you know about my life? Erin is my friend, acquaintence etc etc. I defend whoever I think is correct. If I do not have any life outside of this comic, then I wouldn't be in this world at all. I would have gone and jumped out of the window. If I was and am easily manipulated, then I would have joined gangs and become a criminal. But I study hard and value humanism more than studies. I believe in equal rights and justice, not mass killings and dictatorial powers, leadership or rule. I am not easily manipulated.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1433
Angel_Fish

First of all, did we shout? Did we shriek? I probably did in my first few posts, but no more shouting has come out since.

So it may be illegal. But is there really a law that bans donations? If there is, then please do tell us. I am not being sarcastic here.

You yourself are holding on to your beliefs till death. You believe that we are crazy, pointless or whatever else you think we are. You think that donating to Erin as a "thank you" is wrong. A belief is what you think, what you believe. You may change your mind anytime, but you don't just throw away your beliefs. Even if you no longer belive in what you believed in the past, you have a new belief now. That is why we keep our beliefs.


Posted By: integra_fan

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1401
Mephisto

For your information, Erin was NOT whining. Do you really know what whining is? I doubt you do bacause of your comment. I know that using metaphors does not make you a liar. What I'm trying to point out is that since you labelled Erin a liar because of the joke of making the button say "Donate to Shine", then mataphors would also be considered a lie. Metaphors are not lies but if you want to count Erin joking through the paypal button, then they are. I am not denying that using metaphors is correct and saying that the English language is full of phrases that are lies.

And buskers do not use another artiste's songs. If they did, then it would probably not count as busking at all. From what I have seen, busking does not require you a business licence because your earnings are based on donations. Other people willingly giveit to you. You do not sell things on the roads. However, if it is true that playing on the streets legally requires a licence in America, then forget about that particular part of my argument/example. I am not an American.

Thirdly, we do not worship Erin like an idol. Liking someone insomuch does not make you worship or idolise him/her. Personally, I do not wish to pursue this argument. But if you would continue condemning or/and insulting Erin, I will continue to defend her.


Posted By: Mephisto AKA Devil May Care

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1423
Pippip Cheerio and all that rot

You are absolutely right. In every respect. The discussion here has degenerated to a petty mudslinging match. I had heard good things about the people here and from what I have observed....I was lied to with very few exceptions.
Integra Fan...I really hope that you can get yourself under control. If something as trivial as a person you have never met saying things that you don't agree with about a fictional comic is really that important to you....you need to take a reality check.
Catherine...I came in to this place because, as I mentioned, I have heard some very good things. From what I have seen, you all attack anyone who does not agree with your blind worship of Erin. I find that sad....personally I wish we had all me ton better terms, however the problem with first impressions is that you can only get one. I'd say we all blew that one, eh?
Erin...what can I really say? You have ripped off a man's hard work and are breaking the law...you'll reap what you sow eventually. What happens then is not my problem. You have been warned and chosen to take the low road. Thatis your choice and I will not waste another moment on this comic or you. I'll leave you with these words: May you live in interesting times.

I was raised with the saying "Don't try to teach a pig to sing. It irritates you and the pig." So, I am leaving this pig to oink on its own.
Enjoy your ill-gotten money.


Posted By: Alison

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1433
Everyone

It seems that more people have become involved with this argument. Considering the amount of emotion involved in a number of posts, I doubt that reason will break through. However, I feel the unusual urge to attempt.

All of those who are attempting to use polysyllabic words while being unaware of their meaning, please stop. Tossing large words about while being ignorant of their meaning simply proves your stupidity. If English is not your first language, I applaud your attempt to increase your vocabulary; however, you are simply making a fool of yourself by utilizing words you do not understand. Limit yourself, please. For those of you attempting to intersperse 'big words' with your veiled cursing, again, stop. You have no vocabulary, and pretending you do is only making you look truly foolish. I can respect a well-ordered, articulate argument. Very few individuals thus far have proposed those.

As to the legality of the issue, it's quite simple. Anything which has questionable legality is, speaking by the book, wrong. Lawyers use questionable actions on a daily basis to obtain convictions. Consider this: would any of you, at all, be content with the knowledge that -your- hard work was being capitalized upon by someone? There is not a single person on this board who would be pleased about having their hard work taken.

For those of you who claim Erin works her...fingers to the bone, (I'm leaving out colorful metaphors, here), I seriously doubt this. She did the comic prior to the button, and if she enjoys the work, she will continue to do it after this fiasco has ceased. Any task you take upon yourself in your spare time is not work, and she does not do it for 'us' as readers. Is every request for a cameo granted? Do you all get lines in the comic? Fangirls/boys not withstanding, the majority of the comics are done by Erin herself. Very little outside input is placed into the comic. I can count two cameos in two years, outside of the fangirls. If this comic were produced soley for the reader, it would have absolutely nothing but fan-requested scenes, etc. An artist does work for themselves, firstly, and everyone else last. (Work by comission applies: the artist does so for money.)

Enjoy the overblown sense of self-importance defending something you 'believe' in while you can. This argument has degenerated greatly, with only a couple of individuals retaining any rationale.


Posted By: Catherine

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1453
time to move on

Ga, I'm always forgetting a last couple things. Sorry everyone for multiple posts. :):P

One) I'm not a minor either and write these posts on my free time while waiting for other things to load on other web pages.

Two) Erin has never lied to us. She has always stated bluntly and to-the-point her intentions and actions.

Three) If 'we' are worked up and taking your insults to Erin personaly, arn't you a little worked up in caring enough to go on and on about the law and such? If you are worried about legality, don't send donations and keep yourselves perfectly safe from repercussions. Let Erin and those who donate worry. If you don't get involved, they arn't hurting you in any way what so ever.

Thanks for listening to my points. Peace and new topic all?

Catherine


Posted By: Catherine

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1444
time to move on

Okay, here's a suggestion: Let's just drop this topic as we are never going to come to an agreement that pleases all.

Erin: You're welcome for the support. It's honestly meant and given.

Orange: I resent you saying that we 'fawn over our idol' (ie Erin I trust). That is insulting. I would say the same things to the writter of a comic I totaly hated. I just happen to post here because I take the time to read Erin's comic and thus see this discussion.

Devil: don't worry so much about this. Let the law/companies take care of themselves. Send them the site adress if you think it is moraly necessary. But either way, I think you are not welcomed here if you are going to continue to cause irritation and argument. Let the matter drop or do something about it on your own time, not by arguing on this board. Thank you.

Erin: I don't think they'll care. (the companies/law I mean)

Sepul: The 'implicit agreement' you speak of comes from a certain point of view. The law is flexable, specialy concerning minors and non forced donations. I think the most they'd do is ask her to take the button down.

Erin: How bout changing the poll and killing this patheticly endless argument?


Posted By: Mephisto

Posted On: Jul 7, 2005
Views: 1452
Integra fan

You're not easily manipulated? why is it then that you seem to have no life outside of this comic? You have taken everything that was said against Erin's "donations" as a personal affront...I'd say that this comic means way too much to you.


And for future refernece....xenophobic means that you are afraid of outsiders (often foreign)and their culture.


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