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TOPIC: Some guys can't admit they were wrong

Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 496	Some guys can't admit they were wrong Case in point, our poor George Dubya. Dateline 6/16/4: Despite the fact that the 9/11 Commission Report proves conclusively that there were NO credible links between Osama/9.11 and Saddam Hussein, Bush still stands FIRM behind....Ahhh, what? Faulty intelligence, I suppose. The one "link", one Mr. Atta, the man who was supposedly meeting with guys in Iraq, was in fact in the US during the time of the "alleged meetings", as phone records and ATM surveillance cameras have proven. This is only the first step in recording the sad truth about Bush's presidency for the history books. At best, the Iraq War was one based on faulty intel...at worst, blatant lies and deceit. And still, Bushie is bullheaded and won't admit he was wrong. Kennedy admitted his mistake at The Bay of Pigs...Reagan at Beirut. Why can't Bushie stand by the motto "The Buck Stops Here" and do it, also? I feel for Laura...it must be so much fun being married to a guy who can't admit when he's wrong and say he's sorry! DIO/ROUGH 2004
Posted By: JSK Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 494	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong Bad Bushy Bad! Is he really wrong or is just everyone else? Was hoping this would be something more along the lines of "I got my wife to wrestle with another chick and she got hurt! And I admit I'm wrong for doing it.But still liked it anyways!!!" But, typically its the same old song and dance. JSK (Dean/Micheal Jackson)
Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 489	You're right..... I've seen the light! Bush is right and the rest of the world is wrong. Now I've got it! It's just so funny how thinskinned the Republicans are. I mean, it's okay to admit you were wrong. Hell, Clinton did and it involved his personal life and s hit that was no one else's business. If Clinton had gotten us onto this mess in Iraq, do you really think some of these same Republicans would still say we did the right thing? I think not. It's a double standard. DIO/ROUGH 2004
Posted By: Dionysus Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 484	"Just the facts Maam" So America, what are you now going to do about the president who lied to you in order to wage an illegitimate war against Iraq. In England most people are going to vote Tony Blair out of power for his lies. But surely a pre-meditated mass murder initiated by Blair and Bush should result in both their executions, as what would happen to someone like Hussain or Bin Laden. They all now have something in common regardless of their motivations: they have blood on their hands and are murderers. 9/11 commission discounts Saddam-Bin Laden link Agencies Wednesday June 16, 2004 The commission investigating the attacks on America of September 11 2001 has found "no credible evidence" of a relevant link between Iraq and al-Qaida, contradicting President George Bush's assertion that such a connection justified the toppling of Saddam Hussein. In a report released today, the commission found that Osama bin Laden considered cooperating with Saddam even though he opposed the Iraqi leader's secular regime. A senior Iraqi intelligence official reportedly met with Bin Laden in 1994 in Sudan, the panel found, and Bin Laden "is said to have requested space to establish training camps, as well as assistance in procuring weapons, but Iraq apparently never responded". "There have been reports that contacts between Iraq and al-Qaida also occurred after Bin Laden had returned to Afghanistan, but they do not appear to have resulted in a collaborative relationship," the report said. "Two senior Bin Laden associates have adamantly denied that any ties existed between al-Qaida and Iraq," the report says. As recently as Monday, the US vice-president, Dick Cheney, asserted that Saddam had "long-established ties" with the terrorist network. In making the case for war in Iraq, Bush administration officials frequently cited what they said were Saddam's decade-long contacts with al-Qaida operatives. They stopped short of claiming that Iraq was directly involved in the September 11 attacks but critics say Bush officials left that impression with the American public. The commission's report was released at the beginning of the panel's final two-day hearing on the development of the September 11 plot and the emergency response by the US federal aviation administration and US air defences. "We're going to talk about the evolution of al-Qaida and how it moved from one type of organisation in the late 1980s to a more fast-acting, poisonous organisation in the 1990s, more spread out and dispersed," the Democratic commissioner Timothy Roemer said before the hearing. "We'll be looking at the timeline as to whether or not we had an opportunity to deflect any of the airliners, and how decisions were made by the highest people in government," he said. Today's report also revealed how the leaders of the terror attacks had originally envisaged a much bigger atrocity. It said the man described as the mastermind behind the plot, Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, wanted to hijack 10 planes, including one he would pilot. His plan was to kill all male passengers, land at an airport and make an anti-American speech. Mr Mohammed, who is in US custody at an undisclosed overseas location, told interrogators he initially proposed targeting CIA and FBI headquarters, nuclear power plants and tall buildings in California and Washington state, in addition to the World Trade Centre, the Pentagon and the White House. The report said Mr Mohammed wanted more hijackers - up to 26, instead of the 19 who actually participated. The commission also identified at least 10 al-Qaida operatives who were to participate but could not take part for various reasons including visa problems and suspicion by officials at airports in the US and overseas. But the plan was rejected by Osama bin Laden, who ordered an attack involving four planes.
Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 474	Funny Harry :) Dubya looks so "natural" as a cartoon! DIO/ROUGH 2004
Posted By: legion Posted On: Jun 16, 2004 Views: 467	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong Whelp, I'm afraid that they're really not going to do much of anything about it. They might vote somebody else in, but it won't make any difference. The militaristic stance of the United States since WW2 has not wavered in the slightest regardless of who is in power. Once in a while, some do-gooding leadership type gets elected and starts mouthing off about doing something about it, like JFK or RFK, they get whacked out of the picture pretty quick. The result of decades of this usurption is the War-State you see now. It's a modern day Sparta. The reasons for all this are many and varied, as you know America had a diddely squat army before WW2, they were totally unprepared for the Million Man mechanized blitzkreig rolling across Europe just like every other country was unprepared. (side note: by the way this is the primary reason for "appeasement", not due to some lefty pacifist leanings, but because no one could stop Hilter at the time and they knew it. Meatheads be silent about this from now on, thanks). Anyway, the massive military complex they built up continues to this day, as does its influence in every aspect of American life. While every other country in the world was disbanding its military after WW2, as you would expect in peacetime, the good ole US of A couldn't wait to duke it out with Russia over an assortment of Indochinese swampland. They will give Bush an award, probably honour him with a million dollar funeral just like another old warmonger I know.
Posted By: JSK Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 459	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong SNOOZE
Posted By: JSK Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 456	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong I dont see the Bush or Blair compain running around blasting innocent Iraqis like Saddam did. Besides the UN agreed and its actually stated that Saddam was breaking laws and had been doing so for more than 20 years. You can't impose punishment or do anything about it unless you take action. THE UN- "Saddam you have been bad. Please write on the blackboard I will no kill my own 200,000 times!" "Then bend over for a slap on the ass thirteen times with a wet noodle." That was about it. Back in the day we had Hitler. Today Saddam. Its too bad you people disagree with the justice and freedom handed to the Iraqi people, but you are not them to complain. Most of you are not American's or Brits who are giving their lives to save this country which will in turn make the world a better and safer place. Yet the complaints continue. And if the Brits want to complain for the reasonings of the war so be it. Vote differently like some American's will be doing. I look past the BS and see the truth with whats going on over there. As far as terrorism its wide spread. Thank Saddam for allowing it to happen in his country. Sure, he may not have been seen talking with them or giving money/funds to them only because its bad enough he allowed them to practice on his home turf. The Taliban's focal point is Iraq and Afganistan. Noone did a thing about it for decades. The Taliban never once did a thing to Saddam or any of his people during his long extended decay in power. Think about it. Just because something isn't 100% doesn't mean you shake a stick to it and tell it to go a way. No instead you go after it and kill it while its alive. People now focus on the downfalls of the war and yet theres pleanty if not more positive points about it. Don't budge and keep the same mind frame. Thankfully our country and others didn't feel this way during Hitler's reign. You'd all be F-ed. I mean we'd all be F-ed. JSK (Lurch/Eddy munster 04)
Posted By: alfonsothefan Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 450	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong "While every other country was disbanding its military after World War II.." - Fluffy Hahahahahhahahhahahahahahhahahahhahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahh Stop it your killing me... Whooweee that was a good one!!!!! atf
Posted By: legion Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 447	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong Guess you re-thought the 'SNOOZE' post, eh Mister Wizard? You sure you don't work for a defense contractor or the war department or something JSK? Everybody breaks the UN 'rules' especially YOU and ISRAEL...you two break UN laws by the truck load. I reckon just about every country on earth has broken at least a few UN laws and madates and such. Probably even Canada. Only one got bombed for it.
Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 441	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong But Killah, one point I've made is that Iraq didn't become a breeding ground for terrorism until AFTER Saddam was removed from power and the country was destabilized. Saddam NEVER had anything to do with empowering terrorists in his own country. You now have a power vacuum and who knows how many factions vying for power there. So, we've only traded one brand of killing for another. Ironically enough, as horrible as Saddam was, he understood the tribal mentality in his country and kept a lid on things. And...he was no threat to us. I don't know where you heard the Taliban was EVER in Iraq, but that's totally false. They're based solely in Afghanistan and while we've been conveniently distracted in Iraq, they've had time to regroup. Al Queda is fervently recruiting there again! DIO/ROUGH 2004
Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 439	Collateral damage Insofar as innocent Iraqi civilians killed in the war...it's anywhere from 8-10,000 so far. We don't know the exact number of innocent men, women and children killed by coalition forces...one of our top brass said that they don't keep up with those figures. But it's a result of "Shock and Awe", friendly fire mishaps, failed attempts on Saddam, and various terrorist attacks. We need to be a lot less sloppy, if we're going to be doing this "war thing" so much! DIO/ROUGH 2004
Posted By: JSK Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 436	RE: Oh for the love of Gandi!!!!!!! Exactly Fonz (LOL) Roughy writes/types- But Killah, one point I've made is that Iraq didn't become a breeding ground for terrorism until AFTER Saddam was removed from power and the country was destabilized. Saddam NEVER had anything to do with empowering terrorists in his own country. ----------------------------------------- What in God's name are you talking about? Terrorists who have bombed ships, towns and even our own buildings came from the Middle East. Afganistan & Iraq to be exact. Taliban and other terroristic groups were all over Iraq looooong before we went in over there. Lots fleed to Afganistan & Palistein and some basically stayed blending in. You can tell me until your blue in the face that Saddam knew nothing about them and I simply won't listen because he did. Either way he turned his cheek too many times to it. You think its all Saddam supporters killing our troops? Sure some of the loyalists have no problem blowing themselves up, but the majority shoot or plant bombs etc so they don't die. They want to live and reak havok on us & the people of Iraq for what has happpened to their fallen leader. The terrorists that take our innocent are ones the people of Iraq know. Some are afraid to speak up because its normal for them to be that way. That only says that THOSE people (who are terrorists) resided in Iraq before we went in. We didn't create them. Are you really trying to tell me NO terrorists lived in Iraq before we went over there? Come on man. One terrorist equals two. Its not the point of Saddam being out of power and this is why its happening. They all sided with him thats why. Now its only reason for them to do things. Ofcourse lots are now here and elsewhere! For years they grew and had a place to do it at. Iraq, Afganistan, Palistein etc. And Saddam and his people knew about them and did NOTHING. In the same aspects they did NOTHING to him. But, they did kill those around them that didn't buy into Saddam's plan. Now that his regime has folded were weeding them out. Also, the people of Iraq are beginning to point these people out and will seek justice themselves once they can. It'll all stablize, but again too many people are in a hurry or just for the simply fact that they hate the United States & Bush go against it. I'm not. Going over there was a good thing for the US and the world in general. Besides terrorism happened long before we went over there during this war and the previous one in the early 90's. You rarly heard about car bombings over there because no media would televise it here. And if they did who cared? Now it happens and you REALLY think its not an almost everyday thing that happens over there? Jerry H! Its just that 9/11 opened America's eyes to terrorism brought from a far. In regards to the United States killing the people of Iraq I got news for ya. Saddam's killed more before and during his reign of power. His people had no problem shooting down a family simply for being in the streets or not wearing their clothing properly. Sure, women of Muslum faith are normally treated like dog s h it and theres really nothing we can do about that. But, what in their religious beliefs say they can mow down families, men , women and children all because they didn't agree or follow what Saddam wanted? I thought their faith was suppose to be based on peace? Thats not what Saddam believed or displayed. Not such a great roll model huh? But, this is the guy people are complaining now that he's gone? Tehehehe. Who's to say all the missles and bomb's were all ours that went into the streets and killed all those innnocent people during the 2003 war? Its quite funny how most of those "weapons" were suddenly moved before coalition forces could go in and secure the area. But, immediatly the crowds believe a person who yells "Its a US bomb!" Now you get a thousand towels running around the streets chanting against us. Granted during war death happens. I'm not trying to say during the "Shock and Awwwww" campain the United States didn't kill the innocent. But, in the same sense most were not suppose to be there. Again thank Saddam for allowing his people to get whacked so more Iraqis would hate us and revolt. The thing is not many did. I have a few friends that are in Iraq and some who just came back. They tell me a much different story about what we are doing in Iraq. The dangerous ones are the ones who were always dangerous. The people are still the same people who couldn't wait for this to happen. Rough no offense ofcourse. You know I'm totally on the other side on this one. And won't change my mind unless its a better reason than feeling bad for terrorists and Saddam supporters. The same ones we are out to stop. I seriously can't understand why you still think our troops are intentionally out to kill innocent Iraqis when even the assault made was planned greatly to preserve life during a war! And now its terrorists killing our troops and now their own people. That kinda tells you something doesn't it? And Leege ... shut your neck! JSK
Posted By: legion Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 430	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong re: 'shock and awe' Remember all that hype over the 'shock and awe' as the fawning media treated mass murder like a 4th of July fireworks show? I just read the other day where they missed every single 'high value' target, including the Sadman himself. They caught all those guys later on. So who did they kill when they were shocking and aweing us? All civilians, mostly women and children. Atta boy, Johnny Rambo. The US is leading the pack to be the biggest mass murdering country in the 21st.
Posted By: Rough Posted On: Jun 17, 2004 Views: 369	RE: Some guys can't admit they were wrong I never said we were over there intentionally killing innocent people. Yes, scores of innocent people get killed in wars. We should have never stuck our nose into their business to begin with! Meddling in Middle Eastern affairs is why these Islamic psychos are growing in numbers. Must we stupidly add fuel to the fire? Saddam had no connections to 9/11, hadn't had WMDs in about ten years, and had never attacked us. It's as simple as that. This war was unecessary and I will always believe that. And, I'm sorry but NO....there was no constant barrage of terrorist attacks in Iraq while Saddam was in power (trust me, we would have heard about it). The country has probably never been this unstable. All I'm saying is that all the killings, bombings, assassinations and kidnappings would NOT have happened if we hadn't taken over the country to begin with. It goes without saying, we made all this happen! We set the wheels in motion so that we have the situation we are in now. So people are still dying and terrorism is flourishing as never before because we haven't yet learned that we are fighting an asymmetrical war, empowering these anti Western groups, and creating more hatred and mistrust. There's a very slim chance democracy will ever take root in Iraq. Despite everything, chances are another dictator or theocracy will take over. Hell, most of the top guys in the interim government will probably be dead by 6/30! How do you impose democracy on someone, anyway? And none of the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11 were Iraqi...most were, in fact, from Saudi Arabia of all places. You're putting all Middle Easterners into one convenient basket. The Taliban has always been based solely in Afghanistan, worked hand in hand with Al Queda of course, and has NEVER been connected to Saddam's Iraqi regume. The 9/11 Hearing just proved all that...again! Bush talking about the War in Iraq being about our security is total nonsense. He's, no doubt, made things a lot less secure for us, short term and long term. Afghanistan I actually supported. Al Queda was based there and they were the ones who attacked us on 9/11. If only we would have finished the job, gotten Osama bin Laden and truly squelched Al Queda at its base. Now, Al Queda has firmly reestablished itself there, stronger than ever, and is signing up new guys. A "War on Al Queda" I would have supported. But when Bush calls it a "War on Terror", he implies just that and now we have no telling how many groups gunning for us. DIO/ROUGH 2004

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