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| Posted By: Zack Posted On: May 23, 2005 Views: 702 | RE: Let's put the record straight > bubap About the tree, via physics, you cannot hear it. Yes, the law that vibrations will travel for infinite time can make give you the idea, yeah, you can only hear it to a point of frequency. But if I whispered to someone a football field on the other side of you, "A=5" and then came to you, asking if you heard what A is. Your answer would more likely be no, unless you have hearing like superman. Sound: Vibrations transmitted through an elastic solid or a liquid or gas, with frequencies in the approximate range of 20 to 20,000 hertz, capable of being detected by human organs of hearing. I am not going to answer the other two questions, because if you would open your mind, and think about my questions a little more, maybe you will understand the relationship between these questions and heated debate of telekinesis. > Nick I realize Keith's headache here. You obviously did not read and understand what I had to say. I even made a little example for those that need examples to understand stuff (sometimes I need them). As long as John was told and did not witnessed the mall being closed for himself, it is only a rumor. Rumor: A piece of unverified information of uncertain origin usually spread by word of mouth > Keith As of wasting my time. I am relaxing. I have been playing a healthy portion of computer games. I still love Starcraft. And there are times I want to research on certain phenomenons to see if maybe somewhere there is an answer > Bluetears And it is because Keith is only convinced by logic. And Nick is convinced that logic could be flawed, which equals faith unless his statements of witnessing and or doing telekinesis is actually 'fact' (100% via physics). (I haven't read the entire forum since that would be wasting my time, so I do not know for sure what his accusitions are.) > Everyone Yes, faith is a good thing to have. Like I said humans are wired to become better than others and themselves. In order to reach goals and in order to go above and beyond to find answers to unknown questions, there must be an element of faith which produces desire. It helps us go towards the horizan. Consider our desire to reach the moon. There was possibility. The formulas said that it could happen. There are no substaintial evidence, formulas, or even fractions of formulas in the disovery of finding telekinesis. Maybe pump your blood full of iron that is magnetized and try to pick up metal objects. : shruggs : Here is a quote I read on a NASA.GOV website that had mention of telekinesis. "All unorthodox suggestions warrant consideration, even though one might choose not to devote personal effort to following them up, because the future undoubtedly holds discoveries that are not obviously implied by the present state of knowledge, and we should be on the alert for any phenomena that might contribute to the detection of advanced civilizations elsewhere." |
| Posted By: Zack Posted On: May 23, 2005 Views: 700 | RE: Let's put the record straight > Nick Oh and, yes you are right to state that for Sally, it is not a rumor. But for John it is. |
| Posted By: wizard Posted On: May 23, 2005 Views: 694 | RE: Let's put the record straight Bluetears, You claim to be a girl. So what? Virtually half of the world's population are female so there is nothing unusual in your claim that would cause me to doubt that statement. Your claim is therefore not in the least unusual as I know many girls and do not doubt their existance. You could be lying, but that wouldn't matter to me as you are not making any claims that defy known science. However, if you claimed to be able to levitate, or could do TK, because of the nature of the claim and that both can be regarded as very unusual, for that I would require proof. Makes sense doesn't it? |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 23, 2005 Views: 692 | RE: Let's put the record straight >>>>>>Keith said: >You are not allowed to dispute that daft claim >and say they can't do it. They do not have to >demonstrate it or offer up any proof >whatsoever, they can just make the claim. Obviously there is something wrong with your reasoning faculties. I said that you can't say as a fact that something doesn't exist simply because it hasn't been proven. It would be illogical. If you want to be illogical, go right ahead Keith... |
| Posted By: Keith Mayes Posted On: May 23, 2005 Views: 684 | RE: Let's put the record straight Nicks quote..... "Obviously there is something wrong with your reasoning faculties. I said that you can't say as a fact that something doesn't exist simply because it hasn't been proven. It would be illogical. If you want to be illogical, go right ahead Keith." According to you Nick, if you claimed for instance that you could transform lead into gold by clicking your fingers, nobody can deny it simply because you have never proven it. And you question my logic????? Sorry, Nick, your argument is just plain ridiculous. Im going to fly back to the Andromeda Galaxy now for a short break. Yes, I really am. and you cant say otherwise! If you say I cant do that then I will pour scorn on you for being illogical. Chew on that. |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 671 | RE: Let's put the record straight >According to you Nick, if you claimed for >instance that you could transform lead into >gold by clicking your fingers, nobody can deny >it simply because you have never proven it. > >Chew on that. So, then, you can say that it is a fact that my hair isn't red, since I have given no proof otherwise? A very daft point to try and defend. Making funny things to turn my argument into doesn't exploit errors in my argument, but merely shows how inventive you can be with words. Let us say, for instance, that I could transform lead into gold by snapping my fingers. If I told you I could do that, and you replied by saying: "No, it is a fact that you cannot do it." That would be illogical. Of course, he can not believe me, but to state that it is a solid fact that I can't do it, just because I have no evidence is a fallacy. Oh, and by the way, this isn't my fallacy, but is a fallacy that anyone could type into Google and learn about. The fact that I pointed out that your argument used this fallacy doesn't make the fallacy my own, special "Keith debunking" fallacy. You cannot deny that this fallacy does indeed exist. |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 669 | RE: Let's put the record straight >Im going to fly back to the Andromeda Galaxy >now or a short break. Yes, I really am. and you >cant say otherwise! If you say I cant do that >then I will pour scorn on you for being >illogical. Now, I could actually say you can't and still be perfectly logical about it. You want to know why? Because I am not stating that it is a fact that you can't. It really is just my belief, however a strong one. |
| Posted By: Keith Mayes Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 667 | RE: Let's put the record straight Okay Nick, That's fine, I'm so glad you cleared that one up. So according to you it is okay for me to say that you can't do TK. You agree that it is a perfectly logical statement. According to you its perfectly okay for me to say that, as long as I dont say that it is a FACT that you can't do TK. This way, according to you, I am only stating an opinion and not a fact, so that's what makes it okay. These are your statements remember, not mine. So, that being the case, Then what fault do you find with my statement on my main page...... "1) The two main TK stunts, the most popular 'proof' of TK, are not TK. My 8 point summary then ends with the statement..... "However, that is just my belief, you will have yours. " So go ahead and tell me again why my statement, according to you, is illogical. You have argued this point time after time. You now contradict yourself, with your own words. Now you say its okay. So what exactly is your problem? |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 660 | RE: Let's put the record straight >So according to you it is okay for me to say >that you can't do TK. True... >You agree that it is a perfectly logical >statement. Not true... |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 659 | RE: Let's put the record straight A logical alternative, by the way, would, instead of making the statement: "You don't not have TK." Which would be an illogical conclusion to come to, you could make the statement: "I don't believe that you have TK." This on the other hand, would be perfectly fine and dandy, logically. |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 656 | RE: Let's put the record straight >>>>>>>Keith said: >So go ahead and tell me again why my statement, >according to you, is illogical. We are in fact talking about this statement which you made earlier: >>>>>>>Keith said: >Until it has been demonstrated to exist, it >does not exist, except as a myth Which is totally illogical. |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 653 | RE: Let's put the record straight For example, to show a case where the above argument presented by Keith doesn't hold up logically: There once was a time when people thought that atoms didn't exist. There was no evidence for them, so they thought up grand ideas about elements and such. Although there was no evidence for atoms, they still indeed existed. The actually weren't even rumors, because everyone who thought that they were just rumors were also made entirely out of them. |
| Posted By: Keith Mayes Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 647 | RE: Let's put the record straight Nick, Just to remind you, as you seem to keep forgetting, I started this thread with the comment "Nick, this is for you. You keep referring to my main page where I originally said 'The two main TK stunts are not TK' You argued that my logic was wrong. " Having since covered many postings you have now stated that, in your esteemed opinion, that my statement is true but, again in your opinion, not logical. Well done Nick!. We now understand that in your funny little world of Nick, a statement can be true but not logical. Amazing stuff!! You then go on to say "You don't not have TK." (???? Ehh! ) is illogical, but its okay to say "I don't believe that you have TK." So, I ask you again, as you have failed to answer it, because you realise what a total fool you have made of yourself, what is wrong with my statement on my main page?....... "1) The two main TK stunts, the most popular 'proof' of TK, are not TK. My 8 point summary then ends with the statement..... "However, that is just my belief, you will have yours. " (Read that part again Nick, you seem to keep missing it!!!!!!!) BELIEF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Get it now?) Please note Nick, I say IT IS MY BELIEF (this is different to me saying it is a fact), So according to you, my statement is perfectly fine and dandy, logically. Your words, not mine! So go ahead and tell me again why my statement, according to you, is illogical. You have argued this point time after time. You now contradict yourself, with your own words. Now you say its okay. So what exactly is your problem? Is it okay or not? You started off by saying it was illogical. Now you say its perfectly okay. And your answer is?????????? Do try and answer the question this time! Be honest Nick, you are way out of your depth here. You keep contradicting your own statements and making more of a fool of yourself with every stupid comment you post. Its time you gave up! Really. |
| Posted By: Nick Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 645 | RE: Let's put the record straight >Having since covered many postings you have now >stated that, in your esteemed opinion, that my >statement is true but, again in your >opinion, not logical. Where have I said this? Could you maybe substantiate this claim a little bit? No, I didn't think you could... >Well done Nick!. We now understand that in your >funny little world of Nick, a statement can be >true but not logical. Amazing stuff!! Amazing? Consider this: 1. All dogs are mammals. 2. Pigs can fly. 3. Therefore, pigs are mammals. Is this a logical argument? Is the conclusion true? Then, indeed, I have a illogical argument, with a true conclusion... what's so amazing about that? >Nick, >Just to remind you, as you seem to keep >forgetting, I started this thread with the >comment No, we started with you saying that I would never point out an illogical thing that you have said. You gave it to me by saying that since something hasn't been proven to exist, we can say it doesn't. That is illogical. You said it in your second post on this thread. Now, about your main page. Why is the first one a belief, and then all the rest are facts? You seem to group all the facts together and throw in a belief. What an illogical way to group things, Keith. You statement about it only being your belief is about TK existing, not about #1 in your list. Stop being so daft. |
| Posted By: Zack Posted On: May 24, 2005 Views: 642 | RE: Let's put the record straight Facts \/ Uncertain = Telekinesis Certain = No one has proved TK. Certain = We can not state via fact that TK does or does not exist This debate; no longer is in relationship of TK. You are trying to decipher the question that is unanswerable. Why are you here on Earth. I am about to give you my absolute thoughts. One that believes in what he hear, is someone that is at the end of his game. He is desperate and scared. He is in fear, and is hopeless. Why you ask? Because, you search for a meaning of your life. You are in constant search. Your complete desperateness to find the truth about yourself is defined by- you will believe what anyone says. Which is complete betrayal to yourself. Which means your self-confidence and self-esteem is low. You would also be completely lazy to find any credibility to your statements. The telekinesis technique of working has a slim probability (based on logic). The greatest minds of our time, has not been able to discover any truth behind this myth. They have theories, they have ideas, but no cold hard evidence that would imply it's existence. So how could you state that it exists when you have no cold hard evidence to back it up? You cannot make allegations like this in court, so why would you try to make allegations here. You would be held in contempt if you made allegations like this. You feel that answers that feel good and look good, are completely truthful answers. Hey it sounds right, that means it should be right. Completely lazy approach, but that is what you are doing. Prove it to me, and you have made me realize that hey it is true -you are not so crazy after all! If you are going to be narrow-minded about subjects. If you do not take the time to look outside the box and think of other possibilities. To think, one of the biggest things you have to learn before allegedly performing telekinesis, is to think outside the box. If you disregard it, then you are nothing but a coward. That is what I think about anyone that needs the help of an idol (e.g. God). That is what I think about anyone that is completely convinced that your definition of an answer is the answer. Roll the dice, you will find that there is more to research before making allegations. Stop watching Dragon Ball Z, stop trying to use your force powers. Work on yourself before you work on solving myths. This is friendly advice, not trying to be hostile, but sometimes it is the only way to say it. |
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